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Federal ATF officers search new Bakersfield armory and home

BAKERSFIELD, Calif. - The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives searched a business and Bakersfield home Friday.

EP Armory is owned by Chris Cook. The business opened a storefront March 1 on District Boulevard near Gosford Road.

The store was closed today while agents searched it.

A home belonging to Chris Cook on Holabird Avenue was also searched.

"Obviously when somebody is going through all of your personal things it's pretty unnerving," said EP Armory owner Chris Cook.

The ATF was not able to provide information on the on-going investigation. Grahm Barlowe with the ATF declined to comment on why the store was targeted or exactly what agents were looking for.

Cook said agents told him they were looking for illegal firearms.

The ATF did not prohibit EP Armory from reopening and they did so around 5:30 p.m. Friday.

California-based gun company Ares Armor is currently fending off efforts from the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives to seize not only their 80 percent AR lowers but also the names of 5,000 customers who bought them.

The company has filed a restraining order against a pending ATF raid on the company, which, according to Dimitrios Karras, CEO of Ares Armor, was communicated to him through his lawyer on March 10.

“I was advised that the BATFE had offered to forego obtaining a warrant if Ares Armor was willing to: (a) Hand over all of EP Armory’s 80 percent Lowers, (b) Turn over Ares Armor customer’s private information to the BATFE,” said Karras in a statement.

“In exchange for turning over our customer’s private information, the BATFE said that they would not ‘raid Ares Armor’s facilities and would not pursue ‘criminal’ charges. This made me feel as if I was being extorted,” said Karras.

At the heart of the matter is a series of polymer AR-style 80 percent lowers that Ares had purchased from EP Armory and was reselling. The ATF has argued, based on a determination letter, that the lower is a regulated firearm and not a gun part.

According to Karras, the ATF has incorrectly classified the EP Armory product as a firearm based on faulty information and contends that it is no different from others he has sold in the past. Bakersfield-based EP Armory itself, as well as the home of its owner Chris Cook, was the target of an ATF raid on March 7.

“It seems like ATF is taking the view that the lowers are legally a ‘firearm’ under the Gun Control Act because the can be ‘readily converted’ to a ‘firearm’ So in ATF’s mind they are transferring a ‘firearm” without a NICS check,’ a firearms industry explained to Guns.com Thursday on condition of anonymity.

“While people speak of it, there is no ’80% rule’ The problem is ATF cannot give any meaningful guidance as to when a piece of metal is just a piece of metal and when it is a ‘receiver’ (a ‘firearm’). In part this is because the case law interpreting ‘readily convertible’ is all over the map, up to and including access to a machine shop for a week,” the expert elaborated.

Karras has obtained a Temporary Restraining Order (TRO) from a federal district judge in this matter and is vowing not to turn over any names to the ATF.

“The BATFE has expressed interest in obtaining Ares Armor’s customer list in the past and is now attempting to strong-arm us with undue threats based on information they know to be incorrect. Our customer’s privacy is of the utmost importance to us. I cannot in good moral conscience turn over a list of names to the BATFE just because they unduly threaten us with an unjust raid based on information they know to be false,” Karras wrote on his company’s website.

Ares, a veteran-owned small business in National City, California, is no stranger to controversy, having recently fended off assaults by the city over its rooftop sign. The sign, with an image of an AR-15, has the words “Unserialized. No Registration. Legal.” across the bottom.

As of Thursday the company is still listing several 80 percent lowers for sale on their site, with the exception of the polymer EP lowers.

The ATF advised Guns.com they do not comment on ongoing investigations.

Both Ares and the ATF are set to face off in court on March 20 for a preliminary injunction hearing. Until then, Karras states that, “I am now in constant fear for the safety of my employees, my customers and myself.”

Olly wrote:Kind of BS. According to their logic a rectangular piece of aluminum block is also a weapon because it has the potential to be an lower receiver.

Patriots.

We have as you all know had ATF interaction over the EP80 and the sales thereof. We have been in constant contact with our legal team and have made it extremely apparent that our customers and their privacy are our TOP priority as well as the legality of the sales and manufacturing of our product. Please understand that we are NOT handing any information of any of our customers on an at will basis nor will we. We have had our computers confiscated as I am sure you all have read in the many articles posted all over the internet. We did NOT at any time give them a customer list.

We were served with a search warrant that did not specifically request any of our customers information. We take multiple steps to safeguard your privacy. Therefore we did not give access to any such documents/records/information. Our distributor ARES, located in Oceanside, had a demand in their search warrant for a customer list and was able to apply a TRO (Temporary Restraining Order) in defense. Ares was alerted, and at an advantage due to our circumstances, which was not given to us. Ares and E P Armory are firm believers in our rights as Americans and ensure to uphold them.

Going forward:

Currently all sales and manufacturing of the EP80 have been put on hold until the BATFE can revisit the most recent determination which was on an understanding that the EP80 was manufactured in a way that would not comply with federal GCA (GUN CONTROL ACT) law. We have already previously resent and replied explaining the manufacturing process with no feedback other than a large group of agents entering the premises and confiscating our product and our means to manufacture it, until given further notice.

We feel very confident that litigation from our attorneys will remove the misconception released by the BATFE and will in turn release E P Armory from any charges that could lay ourselves in a criminal court from this.

E P Armory, and all of our employees thank each and every one of our customers and future customers of the support we have received over this whole ordeal.

- Chris Cook
Owner CEO

assateague wrote:

Federal ATF officers search new Bakersfield armory and home

BAKERSFIELD, Calif. - The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives searched a business and Bakersfield home Friday.

EP Armory is owned by Chris Cook. The business opened a storefront March 1 on District Boulevard near Gosford Road.

The store was closed today while agents searched it.

A home belonging to Chris Cook on Holabird Avenue was also searched.

"Obviously when somebody is going through all of your personal things it's pretty unnerving," said EP Armory owner Chris Cook.

The ATF was not able to provide information on the on-going investigation. Grahm Barlowe with the ATF declined to comment on why the store was targeted or exactly what agents were looking for.

Cook said agents told him they were looking for illegal firearms.

The ATF did not prohibit EP Armory from reopening and they did so around 5:30 p.m. Friday.

But it goes further than that. They're demanding customer records.

California-based gun company Ares Armor is currently fending off efforts from the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives to seize not only their 80 percent AR lowers but also the names of 5,000 customers who bought them.

The company has filed a restraining order against a pending ATF raid on the company, which, according to Dimitrios Karras, CEO of Ares Armor, was communicated to him through his lawyer on March 10.

“I was advised that the BATFE had offered to forego obtaining a warrant if Ares Armor was willing to: (a) Hand over all of EP Armory’s 80 percent Lowers, (b) Turn over Ares Armor customer’s private information to the BATFE,” said Karras in a statement.

“In exchange for turning over our customer’s private information, the BATFE said that they would not ‘raid Ares Armor’s facilities and would not pursue ‘criminal’ charges. This made me feel as if I was being extorted,” said Karras.

At the heart of the matter is a series of polymer AR-style 80 percent lowers that Ares had purchased from EP Armory and was reselling. The ATF has argued, based on a determination letter, that the lower is a regulated firearm and not a gun part.

According to Karras, the ATF has incorrectly classified the EP Armory product as a firearm based on faulty information and contends that it is no different from others he has sold in the past. Bakersfield-based EP Armory itself, as well as the home of its owner Chris Cook, was the target of an ATF raid on March 7.

“It seems like ATF is taking the view that the lowers are legally a ‘firearm’ under the Gun Control Act because the can be ‘readily converted’ to a ‘firearm’ So in ATF’s mind they are transferring a ‘firearm” without a NICS check,’ a firearms industry explained to Guns.com Thursday on condition of anonymity.

“While people speak of it, there is no ’80% rule’ The problem is ATF cannot give any meaningful guidance as to when a piece of metal is just a piece of metal and when it is a ‘receiver’ (a ‘firearm’). In part this is because the case law interpreting ‘readily convertible’ is all over the map, up to and including access to a machine shop for a week,” the expert elaborated.

Karras has obtained a Temporary Restraining Order (TRO) from a federal district judge in this matter and is vowing not to turn over any names to the ATF.

“The BATFE has expressed interest in obtaining Ares Armor’s customer list in the past and is now attempting to strong-arm us with undue threats based on information they know to be incorrect. Our customer’s privacy is of the utmost importance to us. I cannot in good moral conscience turn over a list of names to the BATFE just because they unduly threaten us with an unjust raid based on information they know to be false,” Karras wrote on his company’s website.

Ares, a veteran-owned small business in National City, California, is no stranger to controversy, having recently fended off assaults by the city over its rooftop sign. The sign, with an image of an AR-15, has the words “Unserialized. No Registration. Legal.” across the bottom.

As of Thursday the company is still listing several 80 percent lowers for sale on their site, with the exception of the polymer EP lowers.

The ATF advised Guns.com they do not comment on ongoing investigations.

Both Ares and the ATF are set to face off in court on March 20 for a preliminary injunction hearing. Until then, Karras states that, “I am now in constant fear for the safety of my employees, my customers and myself.”

I guess I won't be able to make one now. Sucks that I ran the drill right through the side of mine. Oh well.

assateague wrote:Of they want to make that determination going forward, more power to them, I guess. But making something retroactive like that is bullshit.

3legged_lab wrote:

assateague wrote:Of they want to make that determination going forward, more power to them, I guess. But making something retroactive like that is bullshit.

Yeah, too bad I fucked mine up while trying to finish it.

assateague wrote:I know. It's harder than it looks.

gila-river wrote:I lived in Cuyama just outside Bakersfield for a year setting up a new farm. I went into Bakersfield for shotgun shells and .17 ammo. The place had good prices and I expressed interest in getting residency and maybe buying a new gun while I was over there. The old guy behind the counter asked where I was from and I told him AZ. He was almost irritated with me when I told him that. He said I'd be a damned fool and to keep my AZ license and just go home to buy firearms related stuff.

Redbeard wrote:

gila-river wrote:I lived in Cuyama just outside Bakersfield for a year setting up a new farm. I went into Bakersfield for shotgun shells and .17 ammo. The place had good prices and I expressed interest in getting residency and maybe buying a new gun while I was over there. The old guy behind the counter asked where I was from and I told him AZ. He was almost irritated with me when I told him that. He said I'd be a damned fool and to keep my AZ license and just go home to buy firearms related stuff.

loved that cuyama valley. Hunted a lotta quail in there

assateague wrote:I know. It's harder than it looks.

gila-river wrote:

Redbeard wrote:

gila-river wrote:I lived in Cuyama just outside Bakersfield for a year setting up a new farm. I went into Bakersfield for shotgun shells and .17 ammo. The place had good prices and I expressed interest in getting residency and maybe buying a new gun while I was over there. The old guy behind the counter asked where I was from and I told him AZ. He was almost irritated with me when I told him that. He said I'd be a damned fool and to keep my AZ license and just go home to buy firearms related stuff.

loved that cuyama valley. Hunted a lotta quail in there

It was a really cool place and I met some great people out there. I might have stayed permanently if I wanted to live in CA. Do you remember a big horse racing track and training facility on the south side of the 166 a couple miles east of the buckhorn?

Redbeard wrote:

gila-river wrote:

Redbeard wrote:

gila-river wrote:I lived in Cuyama just outside Bakersfield for a year setting up a new farm. I went into Bakersfield for shotgun shells and .17 ammo. The place had good prices and I expressed interest in getting residency and maybe buying a new gun while I was over there. The old guy behind the counter asked where I was from and I told him AZ. He was almost irritated with me when I told him that. He said I'd be a damned fool and to keep my AZ license and just go home to buy firearms related stuff.

loved that cuyama valley. Hunted a lotta quail in there

It was a really cool place and I met some great people out there. I might have stayed permanently if I wanted to live in CA. Do you remember a big horse racing track and training facility on the south side of the 166 a couple miles east of the buckhorn?

i remember it well

vincentpa wrote:I know a guy who bought one of their 80% lowers. He tells me the EP guys are great guys, super nice and helpful. He milled one of the 80 lowers out and upon assembling the bolt catch, the plunger and spring got stuck because the hole was out of spec. They sent him a new lower free of charge. They did it without blinking.

He spoke to them a few minutes ago. They said not to worry. They stated everything was legal. He assured my friend that the ATF would (not) be kicking his door down. He also said, if it made him feel better, he could destroy it. My friend gave his complete support to the guys at EP and said he'd be pulling for them. The EP guys told my friend to watch the FB page for communication. They will let everyone know the situation from there.

I heard on the news clip that the ATF and EP had a court date on 3/20. Keep and eye out.

gila-river wrote:

Redbeard wrote:

gila-river wrote:

Redbeard wrote:

gila-river wrote:I lived in Cuyama just outside Bakersfield for a year setting up a new farm. I went into Bakersfield for shotgun shells and .17 ammo. The place had good prices and I expressed interest in getting residency and maybe buying a new gun while I was over there. The old guy behind the counter asked where I was from and I told him AZ. He was almost irritated with me when I told him that. He said I'd be a damned fool and to keep my AZ license and just go home to buy firearms related stuff.

loved that cuyama valley. Hunted a lotta quail in there

It was a really cool place and I met some great people out there. I might have stayed permanently if I wanted to live in CA. Do you remember a big horse racing track and training facility on the south side of the 166 a couple miles east of the buckhorn?

i remember it well

We bought that property and farm it now. I lived in that round house up there while we set up infrastructure. Really cool peice of property

aunt betty wrote:

vincentpa wrote:I know a guy who bought one of their 80% lowers. He tells me the EP guys are great guys, super nice and helpful. He milled one of the 80 lowers out and upon assembling the bolt catch, the plunger and spring got stuck because the hole was out of spec. They sent him a new lower free of charge. They did it without blinking.

He spoke to them a few minutes ago. They said not to worry. They stated everything was legal. He assured my friend that the ATF would (not) be kicking his door down. He also said, if it made him feel better, he could destroy it. My friend gave his complete support to the guys at EP and said he'd be pulling for them. The EP guys told my friend to watch the FB page for communication. They will let everyone know the situation from there.

I heard on the news clip that the ATF and EP had a court date on 3/20. Keep and eye out.

FIFY
Pretty sure you meant to put the (not) where I did.
Right?

gila-river wrote:No. Last I heard it had been vacant for 6 years before we picked it up

vincentpa wrote:I know a guy who bought one of their 80% lowers. He tells me the EP guys are great guys, super nice and helpful. He milled one of the 80 lowers out and upon assembling the bolt catch, the plunger and spring got stuck because the hole was out of spec. They sent him a new lower free of charge. They did it without blinking.

He spoke to them a few minutes ago. They said not to worry. They stated everything was legal. He assured my friend that the ATF would be kicking his door down. He also said, if it made him feel better, he could destroy it. My friend gave his complete support to the guys at EP and said he'd be pulling for them. The EP guys told my friend to watch the FB page for communication. They will let everyone know the situation from there.

I heard on the news clip that the ATF and EP had a court date on 3/20. Keep and eye out.