TomKats gourmet beer thread

[vincentpa]

There are a lot of good beers, too many to list in fact. What almost all if these great beers have in common us that they are not made in America, especially from some Podunk "craft" brewery. American breweries always overdo something, be it too much spice or too much hops. They lack the subtlety that their European counterparts have. As far as drinkable lower quality beers go, Canada blows the US out of the water. Moosehead is $21 a case. I call it the poor man's Stella.

I like German Heffe. The wheat adds a distinct flavor and aroma. Belgian beers are fantastic, although Chimay is way too costly to drink daily. Hogaarden is my favorite summertime beer.

That's retarded.

Shiner-Texas
Abita-Louisiana
Goose Island-Illinois
Arrogant Bastard-California

Don't get me wrong, my favorite beer is Chimay and I'll burn the coin to drink it whenever, but to say that there aren't a lot of great beers brewed in America is insane.

Not retarded at all. Of the beers you've listed, I've had Abita, which wasn't bad but not worth the price. The other beers I've never heard of. American beers are like American wines. You never know what you're going to get. The price doesn't reflect the quality as does generally in Europe. I've been burned too many times by bad wines and bad beers "crafted" in this country that had a nice label, high price and was "really good someone said". It seems to me that the ratio of bad beers to good beers is far too high creating too much risk for throwing good money after inferior quality. Maybe I've just had bad luck in choosing micro brews. I don't think so. That would be one hell of a coincidence. The same argument applies for cheese in this country. There's always a lack of something, too much of another thing that demonstrates a lack of subtlety, a lack of true understanding of the process and combination of flavor. I'm always looking for a quality beer that can compete with its European counterpart at a reasonable price. I just haven't found any save Sam Adams, which cost the same as the Europeans. I'll keep an eye out for the other beers you've just listed. Maybe one of those will be the one.

[assateague]

Americans don't need subtlety. Subtlety didn't win two world wars and defeat the Soviet Union. Subtlety isn't what we do. The Europeans can afford to be subtle because they're pussies.

[vincentpa]

Americans don't need subtlety. Subtlety didn't win two world wars and defeat the Soviet Union. Subtlety isn't what we do. The Europeans can afford to be subtle because they're pussies.

Yeah, that's true. When I want to win a war, I'll call America. However, when I want to buy good, beer, wine and cheese, I'll call the Europeans.

[AKPirate]

Americans don't need subtlety. Subtlety didn't win two world wars and defeat the Soviet Union. Subtlety isn't what we do. The Europeans can afford to be subtle because they're pussies.

Yeah, that's true. When I want to win a war, I'll call America. However, when I want to buy good, beer, wine and cheese, I'll call the Europeans.

This reminds me of Oddball, woof woof!

[Mornin Beef]

Americans don't need subtlety. Subtlety didn't win two world wars and defeat the Soviet Union. Subtlety isn't what we do. The Europeans can afford to be subtle because they're pussies.

Yeah, that's true. When I want to win a war, I'll call America. However, when I want to buy good, beer, wine and cheese, I'll call the Europeans.

When I want the authentic, true blue, right down your leg out of no where, non-stop, right along with a fever and extreme fatigue shits I call mexico.

[BrewGUN]

Americans don't need subtlety. Subtlety didn't win two world wars and defeat the Soviet Union. Subtlety isn't what we do. The Europeans can afford to be subtle because they're pussies.

Yeah, that's true. When I want to win a war, I'll call America. However, when I want to buy good, beer, wine and cheese, I'll call the Europeans.

Look up winners of world beer cup or GABF winners and try some of them. You'd be surprised that actually a lot of American brewers can make foreign beers just as good if not better. Granted there are a LOT of little breweries in the USA right now with the craft beer boom, and right now there is a huge focus on quality because there are a lot of them putting out bad beer, and tainting America's craft beer reputation.

[Mornin Beef]

Americans don't need subtlety. Subtlety didn't win two world wars and defeat the Soviet Union. Subtlety isn't what we do. The Europeans can afford to be subtle because they're pussies.

Yeah, that's true. When I want to win a war, I'll call America. However, when I want to buy good, beer, wine and cheese, I'll call the Europeans.

Look up winners of world beer cup or GABF winners and try some of them. You'd be surprised that actually a lot of American brewers can make foreign beers just as good if not better. Granted there are a LOT of little breweries in the USA right now with the craft beer boom, and right now there is a huge focus on quality because there are a lot of them putting out bad beer, and tainting America's craft beer reputation.

it seems a lot of these micro breweries are just a couple of 20 somethings poking at a poor dogs balloon knot. Just running around and swinging cats around by the tail if you get my drift. Olly does.

[Eric Haynes]

Americans don't need subtlety. Subtlety didn't win two world wars and defeat the Soviet Union. Subtlety isn't what we do. The Europeans can afford to be subtle because they're pussies.

Yeah, that's true. When I want to win a war, I'll call America. However, when I want to buy good, beer, wine and cheese, I'll call the Europeans.

Spent 3 years traveling Europe drinking beer and wine. They have nothing on American beer but they own wine hands down. For every good European beer there are 20 shitty ones.

[Olly]

Love me some high class booze.

[WTN10]

Americans don't need subtlety. Subtlety didn't win two world wars and defeat the Soviet Union. Subtlety isn't what we do. The Europeans can afford to be subtle because they're pussies.

Yeah, that's true. When I want to win a war, I'll call America. However, when I want to buy good, beer, wine and cheese, I'll call the Europeans.

Spent 3 years traveling Europe drinking beer and wine. They have nothing on American beer but they own wine hands down. For every good European beer there are 20 shitty ones.

I'll cop to the wine. Bordeaux is the shit.

[assateague]

It's because they have no governmental agency telling them they aren't allowed to put antifreeze in it.

[vincentpa]

It's because they have no governmental agency telling them they aren't allowed to put antifreeze in it.

Are you being sarcastic?

[AKPirate]

It's because they have no governmental agency telling them they aren't allowed to put antifreeze in it.

Are you being sarcastic?

Never

[Tomkat]

Americans don't need subtlety. Subtlety didn't win two world wars and defeat the Soviet Union. Subtlety isn't what we do. The Europeans can afford to be subtle because they're pussies.

Yeah, that's true. When I want to win a war, I'll call America. However, when I want to buy good, beer, wine and cheese, I'll call the Europeans.

I never had a bad meal in Europe.

But they are a bunch of pussies.

[assateague]

It's because they have no governmental agency telling them they aren't allowed to put antifreeze in it.

Are you being sarcastic?

Don't you watch the Simpsons?

[assateague]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1985_diethylene_glycol_wine_scandal

[WTN10]

Americans don't need subtlety. Subtlety didn't win two world wars and defeat the Soviet Union. Subtlety isn't what we do. The Europeans can afford to be subtle because they're pussies.

Yeah, that's true. When I want to win a war, I'll call America. However, when I want to buy good, beer, wine and cheese, I'll call the Europeans.

I never had a bad meal in Europe.

But they are a bunch of pussies.

Not my experience. Met Danes, English, and Italians. All great people. Italians are the best though. None of them speak English, which makes them try harder to be friendly. So much wine.

[Tomkat]

Back in 1980 I dated a girl who liked to drink shots of peppermint schnapps and Chase it was Michelob sometimes I will still do this because it actually is better than what it sounds like

[FlintRiverFowler]

Back in 1980 I dated a girl who liked to drink shots of peppermint schnapps and Chase it was Michelob sometimes I will still do this because it actually is better than what it sounds like

Some days are better than others.
Do they still make Michelob dry?

[Eric Haynes]

Back in 1980 I dated a girl who liked to drink shots of peppermint schnapps and Chase it was Michelob sometimes I will still do this because it actually is better than what it sounds like

Some days are better than others.
Do they still make Michelob dry?

Some days I prefer a bump and a shot of Cabo

[Gunny]

Summit Brewery makes fantastic ales and beers. As goldie stated, Finnegans (bottled by Summit)is very good. Foultons is another good brewery along with Surly Brewing Co. and Third Street Brewhouse.

We are fortunate to have A LOT of craft beer breweries in the land o' 10,000 lakes. Some great, (the aforementioned)... some not so good...

http://mnbeer.com/breweries/

[Tomkat]

Back in 1980 I dated a girl who liked to drink shots of peppermint schnapps and Chase it was Michelob sometimes I will still do this because it actually is better than what it sounds like

Some days are better than others.
Do they still make Michelob dry?

Dont know as I only drink old school mick with schnapps when I see a new blonde DD girl in the Monday Monster thread LoL good times...

[vincentpa]

Americans don't need subtlety. Subtlety didn't win two world wars and defeat the Soviet Union. Subtlety isn't what we do. The Europeans can afford to be subtle because they're pussies.

Yeah, that's true. When I want to win a war, I'll call America. However, when I want to buy good, beer, wine and cheese, I'll call the Europeans.

Spent 3 years traveling Europe drinking beer and wine. They have nothing on American beer but they own wine hands down. For every good European beer there are 20 shitty ones.

I guess Europe's 20 to 1 bad to good beers aren't bad in comparison to the US's 100 to 1 bad to good beers. Every country in Europe is different. Each specializes or excels at one thing or another where some are deficient. Would you compare German cheeses to those of France and Italy? Of course not. The Germans are not known for their cheeses. The Southern Med countries such as Greece, Italy, Spain and France are not known for their beers. They produce mediocre beers at best. There is no comparison to the beers produced by the Southern Med countries to those countries that are known for producing great quality beers such as Germany, Austria, Belgium, Netherlands, England and Ireland. The lowest grade beers of the good beer producing countries are far superior to the average American beer and even to most microbrews. Save Sam Adams, there is no comparison between "good quality" American craft beers to those of the "good quality" beers of the great beer producing countries of Europe. It's tantamount to comparing Kraft Parmesan to Parmigiano Reggiano or Wisconsin cheddar to that of England.

As far as American wine goes, there are American wines that can compete and surpass those of Europe. You just have to know a hell of a lot about American wines to get a good bottle without wasting money paying for start-up costs of a new vineyard or fancy marketing. It helps to have someone to advise you on buying good American wines so you won’t get ripped off.

[WTN10]

Vince, you're engaged in Survivorship Bias.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Survivor_bias

Survivorship bias is the logical error of concentrating on the people or things that "survived" some process and inadvertently overlooking those that did not because of their lack of visibility. This can lead to false conclusions in several different ways. The survivors may be actual people, as in a medical study, or could be companies or research subjects or applicants for a job, or anything that must make it past some selection process to be considered further.

[WTN10]

And if you think Sam Adams is good, I question your taste in beer. Of all those guilty of throwing more hops in beer indiscriminately, they're the worst.

[Tomkat]

Vince is 100% correct. Good post
I would only add that there are more countries in northern Europe than you mentioned that make really good beer. I had some good dark beers from Demmark, good beers in Poland, great beer in the Czech Republic.

I had some killer red wine in France last year.

There is a lot of crap wine in the US and some very good wine here. The only way to know is drink up!

Some of the best red wines are from Chile and Australia. Yep u read that correct.

[assateague]

I despise the terms "bad" and "good" when it comes to how something tastes. Silly, really. I hate all wine- good, bad, European, American. Machts nichts. They all taste like shit to me. If a "good" beer tastes like pine needles to me, I couldn't care less what it tastes like to those who proclaim it "good".

[BrewGUN]

And if you think Sam Adams is good, I question your taste in beer. Of all those guilty of throwing more hops in beer indiscriminately, they're the worst.

Depends on the style of beer your brewing!

[Tomkat]

No one has mentioned Amstel or Heineken. I like em both. I toured their brewery in Amsterdam. Drank Heineken like a fiend that day.

[Feelin' Fowl]

I think Heineken is gross.